ABC Radio Sydney 9 July 2026
ABC Radio Sydney • Jul 9, 2026, 4:09 PM • Item ID: R00135316884
Summary
In a radio interview, Greens Senator Sarah Hanson-Young criticized Australia’s telecommunications industry as effectively unregulated, claiming companies write their own rules and the ACMA has been ineffective. Luke Coleman, CEO of the Australian Telecommunications Alliance, countered that the sector is heavily regulated by multiple bodies, including the ACMA and ACCC, and argued that no network is immune to outages. He noted that while recent outages are more noticeable due to reliance on mobile services, there is no evidence they are becoming more frequent, and supported proposed legislation to strengthen the ACMA’s enforcement powers.
Interview: ABC Radio Sydney Drive at 04:09 pm 09 Jul 2026.
Presenter:…That’s Telstra CFO Michael Ackland there again apologising to customers today. Well, if you were listening to ABC Sydney Mornings with Melanie Tait today, you might have heard Greens Senator Sarah Hanson-Young saying this is not just an issue with Telstra; that there’s also a major issue with the way the whole industry is regulated.
Extract from earlier interview with Senator Sarah Hanson-Young: The problem here, Melanie, is we have a system that is basically unregulated, or it is regulated under self-regulation. That is, the companies themselves write their own rules. And we’ve got a government body that is meant to oversee them, the regulator, the Australian Communications and Media Authority, that really hasn’t been up to the job. So, we’ve got weak rules and a weak regulator.
Presenter: Luke Coleman’s the CEO of the Australian Telecommunications Alliance, which is the peak body for the Australian telecommunications industry. And he’s with you now on Drive. Hi Luke.
Luke Coleman: Thanks for having me on the programme.
Presenter: It’s a pleasure. I did play a little bit just then of what Sarah Hanson-Young said this morning. Do we have an issue with the way the industry is regulated in Australia?
Luke Coleman: I certainly think that after the recent events, it’s important that we have the right regulations in place that are actually going to solve the problem. The reality is the telco sector is regulated directly. We do already have a regulator in the ACMA which is there that is able to investigate issues when they occur, and it is able to fine telcos when there have been breaches. So, it is simply untrue to claim that the sector is unregulated. Telco is one of the most heavily regulated sectors in the economy. We actually have two regulators. We have both the ACMA that looks after consumer protections. We also have the ACCC that looks at economic regulation for the telco sector. Even when it comes to outages, telcos are also regulated as critical infrastructure providers. That means that under legislation, under the Security of Critical Infrastructure Act, telcos already have obligations when it comes to risk management to ensure their networks are up as often as possible; they have plans in place when their networks go down. And so, it’s simply not true to say that the telco sector is unregulated or self-regulated. We’ve got a number of regulators. And what is important here is that we have the right regulations in place to ensure that those networks are as resilient as possible.
Presenter: So, what do you say then to the Senator’s comments that the telcos write their own rules?
Luke Coleman: I would simply say it is not true. The reality is when it comes to outages, no amount of regulation is going to make any network completely immune to outages. That’s not just telco. That’s electricity, water, gas, transport networks. Any network is going to inevitably have an outage at some point. The challenge is how do we minimise those outages? You know, every single day there are more than 40 utility strikes. That might be a cut to a telco cable under the footpath. It might be a cut to an energy network or a gas network. Every single day, we see 40 of those. All of the regulation in the world is not going to stop a cut to a fibre cable or a truck crashing into a mobile tower and knocking it out. Maybe it’s a bushfire or a flood. There is always going to be events which disrupt any service on any network, whether it’s telecommunications or electricity or any other one. What really matters is getting those services up as quickly as possible and getting them back online.
Presenter: It does feel though like we’re seeing more of these outages. I’m wondering if that’s a fair assessment or is it just that we notice them more because we’re so reliant on mobile phones?
Luke Coleman: The reality is we do notice them more because we are so reliant on our mobile phones. If you think about it, the network was down for about five hours yesterday before service has been restored to around 90% of their capacity. Now, if there’s around 8,800 hours in a year, down for five hours, that’s 99.95% of the time that you don’t even think about your network because it always works the rest of the time. If it’s down for five hours, you absolutely notice it because it might disrupt your train service or when you go to buy coffee at the local cafe. We have never been so reliant on mobile services as we are today. So, of course, we notice a lot more when we don’t have access to those services that we’re used to, but the reality is more than 99.95% of the time you do have those services.
Presenter: Are the outages becoming more frequent though?
Luke Coleman: There’s no evidence to say that they’re more frequent today than they might have been 10 or 20 years ago. And in fact, when it comes to outages, again, telcos are already regulated. There is regulation in place that says telcos need to report outages. When they occur. There is an outages register. This is regulated by the ACMA. So there’s already regulation in this area that is holding telcos to account as critical infrastructure providers. That information is publicly available. Having those outage registers there mean that you can track how often they occur. The information is made available to the public. But as I said, what really matters to people when these networks go down, everyone’s focus needs to be on getting them fixed and back online as quickly as possible. Adding more regulation into that process is only going to serve to distract them from actually fixing the problem. That needs to be the key priority when networks go down. And like I said, there is no network that is going to be 100% immune from outages.
Presenter: Critics, though, say without a stronger watchdog and tougher penalties, you know, there’s not really an incentive for telcos to actually try and prevent these or to deal with them any differently. What would you say about how Telstra handled this outage yesterday?
Luke Coleman: We already have a tough watchdog on the beat in the form of the ACMA. There is actually legislation before Parliament right now that will give the ACMA stronger powers to clamp down on telcos for any breaches of industry codes. So, we support that legislation. We want to see a strong regulator, and we already have a strong regulator. This legislation would give them even greater powers to fine telcos for any breaches of those codes. And we’ve seen in the past when issues have occurred, the ACMA has stepped in and fined telcos. So we have a strong cop on the beat that is there to keep the industry in line and to clamp down on those issues, to investigate them when they occur.
Presenter: Telstra could potentially face penalties in the tens of millions of dollars. Do you see those fines as an adequate punishment?
Luke Coleman: Those fines have recently been increased after the recent Triple Zero outage, which occurred last year. Fines are one way of going about it, but ultimately, you will never prevent outages from occurring just because you’ve got higher fines in place. Like I mentioned earlier, there’s 40 strikes on utilities every single day. Having fines in place doesn’t stop someone digging up a footpath and cutting through a fibre optic connection. Having a sensible, risk-based approach to minimise the risks to these networks – as we already have under the Critical Infrastructure Act – that is a sensible way of going about this. Remember, with telco, unlike energy, you’ve got a range of networks that are available. If you can’t call Triple Zero on your primary network, that call will automatically be diverted to another network so you can make that call. We’ve got three, competitive telecoms networks when it comes to mobile; we’ve got the National Broadband Network where you can make a call via Wi-Fi. Increasingly, we’re seeing alternatives like satellite networks as well.
Presenter: It doesn’t make a difference though for those people that are stranded with a life-or-death situation when the network is down. Do you think Telstra customers are entitled to some cash to make up for yesterday?
Luke Coleman: It actually does give you alternatives when the network is down. You are able to make a Triple Zero call via alternative network, if there is an alternative network available.
Presenter: But we’ve seen that that’s not always the case. And we have seen, you know, for example, there are old people, they have one way of communicating. They don’t have a second device when that’s the advice that’s been given. So, can you understand the frustrations of people who are in circumstances like that?
Luke Coleman: Even in those cases, your device will look for any other available network to be able to make a Triple Zero call. Or if you’ve got Wi-Fi at home, it’ll try to make that call via Wi-Fi. Having layers of protection ensures the greatest ability of alternatives if there is an outage. Again, this is different to other sectors. If the energy is out, you don’t have alternative networks. In the telco sector, you do. Having a strong, competitive market where telcos are investing in those networks, that is the best possible solution because that gives consumers alternative options as opposed to regulation.
Presenter: With the greatest of respect, Luke, I’m getting a lot of messages come in from listeners who are saying that this is just PR spin. They don’t believe that telcos are actually willing to take accountability and do something differently. I mean, what’s your response to that sort of criticism?
Luke Coleman: I would say Telstra has taken accountability here. You played that clip earlier of Telstra’s CFO, who stood up for the second day in a row to explain what’s happening and what they’re doing to fix these issues. And as I mentioned, we have a range of protections available that telcos do today to ensure that if you can’t call Triple Zero on your home network, there are alternatives available. All of that is regulated today, and that’s something that we need to take into account. When we call for new regulation to be put in place, this is a sector that already has a range of regulation over outages to ensure you can call Triple Zero from alternative networks as critical infrastructure providers. Those regulations are already in place.
Presenter: Just finally, it was in 1996 that the former Prime Minister, John Howard, first announced plans to privatise Telstra and the transition to a fully privatised company happened by 2006. Is there an argument with these outages that we’re seeing that we should have a government-owned telecommunications provider?
Luke Coleman: We already do. It’s called the National Broadband Network. That is our national fixed line network operator. And that’s already in place. We have a competitive market with three mobile network operators. And if you look all around the developed world, that’s the standard: three mobile network operators in any market. Provides you with great competition. If you’re unhappy with your provider, you can walk away and go to another one. We’ve got safeguards in place to ensure that if your network operator isn’t available where you are, you still call emergency services from another network. And, on top of that, we’re seeing new market entrants, like Starlink, which is offering satellite to mobile connectivity as well. So, there is an additional layer of protection available if you don’t have access to your primary network. The best solution here is more competition in the market, and that’s what we’re seeing develop.
Presenter: All right, Luke Coleman, I appreciate your time today.
Luke Coleman: Thanks for having me on the programme.
Presenter: That’s Luke Coleman, CEO of the Australian Telecommunications Alliance, the peak body for the Australian telecommunications industry. I am getting a big response on the text line from that, so I will read a few of those in a minute, but we’ll just move on for now and come back, I think.
Station identification back-announcement: This is 702 ABC Sydney. You’re with Sarah Geraghty.
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